Re: DynIP mail blocking considered harmful (was: Re: My email is rejected by some sites)

From: Joerg Rossdeutscher (ratti_at_gesindel.de)
Date: 12/17/03

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    To: debian-user@lists.debian.org
Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2003 20:37:09 +0100

    Hi,

    Thanks for your useful mail. This thread started to fill my killfile...
    :-)

    Am Mi, den 17.12.2003 schrieb Karsten M. Self um 01:21:
    > - There are highly specific filters and methods which can effectively
    > discriminate between spam and non-spam content. Activity-based
    > lists, Bayesian and content-based filters, reputation systems,
    > teergrubbing, rate-limiting, and the like.

    Yes, but.

    Why should /I/ install lots of software to enable others to have a
    mailserver on their DynIP?

    But, at that point, I see the discussion drifting away, since my
    expression was not against having "a mail server" (BTW: What is a
    mailserver? POP3? SMTP? Both? IMAP? A caching-only fetchmail with a
    just-inhouse pop3?). I argued against mailservers *without smarthost*. I
    also run a smtp that delivers my mails in the background and a
    cron-fetchmail that fetches all the mails from mailinglists while I am
    still at work - it's just the "direct" mail communication between DynIP
    and recipient I'm against. There should be a smarthost that's always "on
    air", always accepts answers, is still there in 10 minutes and has a
    backup mx in a different network.

    > > This is *not* censorship, by the way.
    >
    > No. It's arbitrary discrimination.

    You are not discriminated - just use a smarthost, drive 50 km/h and put
    your chewing gum in the dustbin. :-)
    Why should my server deal with undeliverable error-messages and no-reply
    from now offline machines or reply from a different machine that has
    "now" your old IP?

    > > > Oh yes, and blacks to the back of the bus, please; just be happy we
    > > > let you on at all.
    > >
    > > It's a weak argument that requires a comparison to racism to be heard,
    > > not to mention that it demeans the plight of those affected by racism.
    >
    > The similarity is this: a secondary indicator is being used to
    > establish an absolute preference for or against a specific activity.
    > Despite the known invalidity of this indicator in a large number of
    > cases. And the existence of more specific, accurate discriminators.

    If black people /would/ use the bus without paying, make noise in the
    bus or steal the bus - it would not be discrimination.
    Since they don't do that more often than others, it /is/ discrimination.

    A DynIP-mailserver /does/ indeed often(!) behaves more badly than a
    "normal" one. For example, mail to it must often stay on my server since
    the DynIP-Server just isn't online, has no backup-mx and it's more often
    source of spam.

    It's just a form of filtering, like spamassassin. Use the word "f*ck"
    and get 1 point. :-) Use a DynIP and get 5. No, it's not fair, since I
    like f*cking and I have a DynIP, too, but I prefer to drop 1000 spam
    mails even if one real mail gets five points.

    BTW: The discussion misses another important point: More and more
    providers block ports below 1024. Then you change to another provider?
    OK - but then choose one with a reliable smarthost. One never knows...
    :-)

    Bye, Ratti 

    -- 
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