Re: Configuration DB

• Previous message: Alvin Oga: "Re: Duplicates driving me crazy"
• In reply to: Tong: "Re: Configuration DB"
• Next in thread: John Hasler: "Re: Configuration DB"
• Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ] [ subject ] [ author ]

Date: Sun, 8 Aug 2004 17:32:23 -0700
To: debian-user@lists.debian.org

on Sun, Aug 08, 2004 at 02:42:32PM -0400, Tong (sun_tong_001@yahoo.com) wrote:
> On Sun, 08 Aug 2004 13:02:36 -0400, Greg Folkert wrote:

> > On Sat, 2004-08-07 at 15:09, Tong wrote:
> >> Yes, that is my question -- is there any way to avoid those hard and
> >> tedious questions, since I've answered them once, and the system should
> >> have kept the answer somewhere, or, Debian just forgets those answers
> >> right away? then how do you do reconfiguration?

> > I don't know what you all are on about. Personally, I am on the same
> > "install" of Debian since I first installed it on my primary home
> > machine (and work for that matter)

> Seems to me you a guy who doesn't mind rolling up sleeves and doing the
> dirty work (those different systems need a hell time to configure,
> right?). I'm not. I'm just too lazy.

If you're lazy, go back to Windows. Really. You'll save us a lot of
grief, and you'll transfer it back where it belongs.

You might want to read the following list thread from a few years back:

    http://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2001/04/msg01818.html

In fact, I'd strongly recommend you do.

The "dirty work" largely consists of:

  - Change /etc/hostname (if you're creating a new box, rather than
    moving an old one). You'll find that that's a one-line, one-word
    file.

  - Update your network config, if necessary, in
    /etc/network/interfaces. Likely: you modify the last quad of the
    "address" line for eth0. That's it. You'd have to do same in
    Windows, but through the "Networks" control panel dialog. Unless
    you're using DHCP, in which case, no change needed.

  - Possibly modify /etc/hosts if you reference your hostname there.

  - Modify /etc/fstab to point to the partitions and mountpoints on your
    new system.

  - Add appropriate modules necessary for drivers to /etc/modules.
    Easiest way to do this is to boot Knoppix which autoconfigures
    itself to your system, and note the modules it uses. Basically:
    ethernet, sound, filesystems, and any specific devices (usb, other
    hotplug) you need. Yes, this could be a bit more transparent, but
    it's pretty painless.

If you don't know what you're doing: an hour talking on IRC with
someone who does. If you do know what you're doing: 5 minutes with
$EDITOR.

> My side of the story,
>
> Tired of making choices during installing and configuration, started
> from RedHat 7.2 (till RH9), I build a installation disk of my own, using
> RedHat kickstart. All the tools I want are in, while all those I don't are
> thrown out. Official RH release is 3 disks, mine is just one, and the
> package are kept being updated (by apt-get of cause). So far it is almost
> the same as you cpio solutions, but read on.
>
> Whenever there is anything wrong with my current system, (my current
> situation is the best example -- leaving the box on for months and all
> of the sudden the mouse under X doesn't works), with my old RH system,
> I don't care what I did during those months and trying to figure out
> why. Just pop in my dear installation CD and 10 minutes later, I get a
> fresh system as good as new, and everything to my taste. FYI, I've
> been spending 4 days already, trying all sorts of things, but nothing
> works -- because I don't know how I can achieve this in debian, yet.

The "reboot, reformat, reinstall" mentality is a *really* bad habit
learned from too much time with Microsoft products.

Misbehavior under Linux is virtually always due to something changing:

  - New software.
  - New hardware.
  - Modified configuration.
  - Broken hardware.

The question then becomes "which is it". Since pretty much everything
Just Works[tm], when it doesn't, you've got a pretty clear indication
that Something Is Seriously Wrong.

I've never had the need to reinstall Debian to fix a broken
configuration. I *have* had the need to reinstall packages due to other
problems, ranging from hardeware failure to operator error (memo to
Self: do *not* fsck mounted filesystems). Which _can_ be achieved,
often on a running system. Sometimes you have to resort to a chroot
under Knoppix.

 
> Now the best part. How much time do you think I will spend on
> installing and configuration in different systems like you just
> mentioned? Still, 10 minutes each. RH HW detect set everything for me
> almost automatically. Now think back, for all the different systems
> you have, how much time did you spend on configuration? ;-)

Through Woody, Debian's installers didn't do much autodetection. The
candidate installer for Sarge (forthcoming Debian release) is reported
to do much, much better. Advise you give it a shot.

Note that it's still a work in progress, though it's nearing completion.
 
> I'm just lazy.

You know, so am I.

I prefer to put the minimum amount of work into maintaining my system to
my needs and understanding as possible. And in my experience, Debian's
the way to do that.

You may need to reinstall your RH systems every few months (that's a
horrible track record, BTW). With Debian, there simply isn't that need.
If you can track stable (very few changes, but also no upgrades), you're
going to find one of the most readily maintainable systems bar none. If
you need the features and chrome of a more current release, you'll find
many folks (including such former diehard RH advocates as Mssrs Folkert
and Whysall) will tell you that Debian offers the currency of a recent
RH / Mandrake / SuSE release, with generally better quality and
stability.

> The last thing I want to do is to do things again. I spent weeks
> working on my installation disk and keep updating it, but I hadn't had
> much chances to enjoy it. Ah, you now know that I'm also stupid. :-)
> 'cause the payoff is just minimum. :-) Yet I have a dream that I can
> do this in Debian, and am still attempting...

I'd suggest the following two-step self and system improvement program:

  - Stop whinging. It's more than old already.

  - State your goals, steps taken, and problems encountered simply and
    clearly. This will get you the best and fastest help.

Peace.

-- 
Karsten M. Self <karsten@linuxmafia.com>        http://linuxmafia.com/~karsten
    Ceterum censeo, Caldera delenda est.
-- 
To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-user-REQUEST@lists.debian.org 
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster@lists.debian.org

• Previous message: Alvin Oga: "Re: Duplicates driving me crazy"
• In reply to: Tong: "Re: Configuration DB"
• Next in thread: John Hasler: "Re: Configuration DB"
• Messages sorted by: [ date ] [ thread ] [ subject ] [ author ]