Re: Programming Languages, "to C or not to C, that is the Q."

From: Michael Z Daryabeygi (mzd_at_sligowebworks.com)
Date: 01/25/05

  • Next message: Andrew Walbran: "Re: Problem compiling (gcc? glibc?)" 
    Date: Tue, 25 Jan 2005 16:29:24 -0500
To: Steve Lamb <grey@dmiyu.org>

    on a line at a time basis, what could be more clear than a language
    written with only eight characters?
    Your extreme example serves to show that clarity is dependent on the
    programmer.
    It is not the language that needs to be clear, it is the program.
    In general the larger the vocabulary and therefore the longer
    requirement to become proficient, the less clear.
    Once you are proficient, clarity is all on the programmer. That was
    Peter's point. So I guess I haven't added anything to the discussion....

    I remember how baffled I was when I first went from ASP and VBScript to
    PHP. I thought, "Why the HELL do I need all these ways to do the same
    thing?"
    But with a limited toolkit one must sometimes bend over backwards and in
    the process create opaque code. So ultimately, a rich toolkit can lead
    to more elegant code though it is opaque to the novice.

    Steve Lamb wrote:
    >
    > This is disingenious to say the least. Are you trying to say that
    > brain*** is just as clear as, say, Perl? For some examples:
    > http://esoteric.sange.fi/brain***/bf-golf-results/results0.txt
    >
    > Extreme cases, to be sure, and yet Perl has such a lovely thing as this
    > ${$foo} which is far simpler in Python (being just foo). Just as
    > brain*** is, as it's name implies, a brain *** so too is Perl harder
    > to read than Python. That isn't a matter of subjectiveness. It can be
    > argued on a quantifiable level.
    > 

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