RE: KVM FYI

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Date: Sun, 20 Jun 2004 13:52:12 -0700
To: "For users of Fedora Core releases" <fedora-list@redhat.com>

Hi,

Sean, this message is NOT directed at you. It is intended to
be directed at *all* developers that have an 'attitude' with
regard to what goes into Linux.

=====================================================
Previously, I had said that my Belkin KVM worked when
using .proto=imp but alas that is NOT the case. I am
now testing the .proto=bare case but wont know till I
check it out every few days switch between computers.
(The problem (jumping cursors) does not break right away
but it *does* break in the case of imp.)

I also want to add a comment on what Tom is trying to say
(although I don't want to put words in his mouth) to those
of you too lazy to implement a fix for issues like this:

"Microstiff is probably happy and gleeful that idiot programmers
of Linux just don't get it from a business perpective. M$ will
continue to RULE the desktop because they attend to the details
and FIX things that support OLD hardware including the "lowly"
Belkin KVM! THEY ARE THE PROFESSIONALS AND WILL CONTINUE TO
DOMINATE THE DESKTOP!!!"

I hope that I have been able to get your blood boiling red hot? Mine
is. It is *not* a good attitude that old hardware will no longer be
supported or comments like: "Get new hardware, its too old", or "hey!
its not MY problem. Fix it yourself!" There are *many* reasons why
old hardware is still around and a LOT is because of economics, even
in the richest country in the world (there are still poor people in
it). I want to add that I saw a URL somewhere that there is an
organization
that restores OLD computers so that poor people, schools, the needy
whatever can use them and the plan was to install LINUX on it! I
*don't*
think it is reasonable for them to: 'Sorry, get NEW hardware." attitude
will fly here :-( Not that they will necessairly get a KVM -- but hey!
WHO KNOWS ;-)

Please at MINIMUM to direct people to the right source, links,
documentation,
or 'How to do it yourself' so that others with a vested interest might
be
able to do something about it because time is cheap for them compared to
the alternative.

Best regards,
Dan

-----Original Message-----
From: Tom Diehl [mailto:tdiehl@rogueind.com]
Sent: Sunday, June 20, 2004 12:56 PM
To: Sean Estabrooks
Cc: For users of Fedora Core releases; linux@bytebot.net
Subject: Re: KVM FYI

On Sun, 20 Jun 2004, Sean Estabrooks wrote:

> On Sun, 20 Jun 2004 15:04:01 -0400 (EDT)
> Tom Diehl <tdiehl@rogueind.com> wrote:
>
> > On Mon, 21 Jun 2004, Colin Charles wrote:
> >
> > > On Tue, 2004-06-15 at 10:16, Dwaine Castle wrote:
> > >
> > > > I've never received a reply from the vendor about FC2 support,
but at least
> > > > one user speaks highly of this product.
> > >
> > > KVM's are usually software agnostic - they should "just work"
> >
> > It would be nice if that were true. Upgrading to the latest kernel
> > for fc2 broke my mouse. Switching back to the old one fixes it
again.
> > It is broken in both X and the text console. Moving the mouse
slightly
> > causes it to jump all over the screen. I would put it in bugzilla
except
> > I know they will just close it and say kvm's are unsupported.
Personally
> > I think that stinks but who am I. They want to appeal to enterprise
customers
> > but will not support a piece of hardware that is used by 99% of
enterprise
> > customers. Yes I know this is Fedora core but the attitude is the
same for
> > RHEL.
> >
> > Just my $.02
> >
> Tom,
>
> This is more of a kernel issue. The problem is that the KVM
implements
> an internel virtual mouse that is connected to all but the focused
computer.
> These internel mice are implemented with varying degrees of success
> and feature support by KVM manufacturers. With many KVM's these
> virtual mice confuse the kernel input subsystem and thus when you
> switch back, mouse functionality is disrupted.
>
> You can use:
>
> psmouse.proto=bare
>
> on the kernel boot line and that will usually work to make the kernel
ignore
> poorly implemented virtual mice in a KVM switches. The price
> you pay is scroll wheels and extra buttons won't work. This is
usually
> not a big problem in situations where KVM's are employed.

I do not know where you work, but wheel mice are the norm everywhere I
work.
It worked before so as far as I am concerned some change in this latest
kernel broke it. I have had this kvm for 3 years without a problem. It
worked
with RHL 7.3/8.0/9, FC1, FC2 until now. I just looked in bugzilla and
saw the
same suggestion. The problem is that for me not having my wheel work is
just as bad as not having the mouse work. I am used to having it so if
it
does not work, I will waste time scrolling the wheel.

I realize some of the software in the kvm's are crap but they are not
going
to go away. At the very least Red Hat should put some of them on the HCL
and
say these are supported. At least then I would have an idea what to buy.

The way things are now it is a crap shoot and even if you get one that
works
perfectly today, tomorrow some change to the kernel might break it.

If the one I have had never worked I would have sent it back. For
obvious
reasons that is not an option now.

One other thing I have noticed, with the old kernel switching between
the
different machines with the kvm was instantaneous. With the new kernel
there is about a 1 second delay. Something changed and it is not for the
better.

Regards,

Tom

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