Re: CHECKSUM is not easily accessible on Fedora Download Page

On Sat, 2011-01-22 at 20:16 +1030, Tim wrote:
On Fri, 2011-01-21 at 13:03 -0500, Máirín Duffy wrote:
The biggest challenge in not losing folks before they even give Fedora
a chance is making it easy when they have to figure out how to get the
ISO to optical media or to USB (the latter which can be really
challenging.) Weighing the pros and the cons here, I'd rather have
someone running Fedora and be less prone to viruses and security
break-ins rather than lose them altogether when they give up trying to
learn ISOs, liveusb creation, checksum checking, and GPG all in one

If you encourage the "just click and don't think mentality," you
perpetuate much that's wrong with that other OS. The trick is to
explain it succinctly (i.e. *accurately*, and quickly).

That's far from the goal. It's more, "enable people to try Fedora and
not end up wasting their time, frustrating them, and leaving them hating
Fedora afterwards without even giving it a fair shot mentality."

e.g. What's an ISO disc image file, and what do I do with it? It's an
compilation of files, the files contained inside it will be placed on a
disc. The ISO file will not be simply copied to the disc, as a file.
You will use CD/DVD burning software that takes an ISO file, and uses it
to create a disc. This disc will contain hundreds of files, and will be
self-bootable. The install will start when you boot from this disc.

It really needs to be a short paragraph. Exactly how to do it, is
another step. If they can understand the explanation, it's much more
likely that they'll be able to successfully do it.

Your example is far from a short paragraph.

They don't have to learn it all in one go. They need brief explanations
of what the options are, enough so that they can understand at least one
of them. So they can pick which one to use.

We have all of that on the page right now. We have simply left out

You can't cater for the completely clueless. If they don't know what
"booting" is, they're going to have to learn that first. And, to be
blunt, if they don't know that is, I don't think they know enough about
computing to change OSs, nor install a new one. That's why new
computers come with pre-installed OSs, for those who just want to buy a

The woman in the comic clearly knew what 'booting' was, just had never
referred to it as 'booting' before. More common language is, "start up"
or "turn on" or "load." In general though, her remark in that frame was
more to point out the 1980's sexiness of our current syslinux splash can
be intimidating if that makes sense.

I don't think USB is going to get easy until all the various OSs make it
easy to right-click a USB drive and "make this drive bootable," and you
put files onto the drive that will be auto-booted. i.e. The first file,
the one it boots, would have a common file name.

The idea of a bootblock that handles that is better, but that requires
bootblock writing features that aren't available to ordinary users, like
dragging one or two files to a disc are. You'd really need a "download
a Fedora installer for Windows" and another for Mac, that'd
intelligently find the USB drive the user plugs in when prompted, so it
only writes to the right drive, then puts everything on it.

Yeh, I agree. One thing I've been thinking of is offer LiveUSB creator
for Linux / Mac / Windows as the default install. It automatically
downloads the ISOs for you. I think it will need a lot of work before we
can do that, though.


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