Re: New To Linux

From: Quag7 (quagseven_at_frostwarning.com)
Date: 04/05/05 

Date: Tue, 05 Apr 2005 11:14:56 -0700

On Sat, 02 Apr 2005 12:32:36 -0600, Bit Twister wrote:

> On Sat, 2 Apr 2005 19:07:55 +0100, Steve Homer (M0KQU) wrote:
>
>> Can anyone point me in a starting direction as there are many MANY forms of
>> linux out there - im just not shure where to start
>
> Go to each linux vendor's site and see how you like them.
> Use http://www.distrowatch.com to get to their site.
>
> To see if Mandraklinux is easy for a newbie, check chapter 3
> http://doc.mandrakelinux.com/MandrakeLinux/100/en/Starter.html/
>
> Tips for the brand new linux newbie:

You're going to be completely frustrated at first no matter what you use
just because of how different Linux is from Windows (you'll have to
unlearn some habits and ways of thinking about things, and learn some new
ones). I think for your first distribution, any major non-specialized
distribution is just fine.

I haven't used it but the reasoning to use Knoppix, as a beginner, seems
to make a lot of sense because it reduces the likelihood that you'll have
to mess around a lot with hardware. (Though the gap is narrowing;
I've been kind of impressed with how well Debian has been doing in
hardware detection).

I started with Mandrake. That used to have a reputation as a beginner's
distro, but it's become (it seems from watching online forums) a pretty
popular general purpose distribution. At any rate Mandrake's install
process and so on is intended to be hassle-free and "shiny." It's a
gentle introduction to Linux.

Red Hat/Fedora, the reasoning goes, is a good distribution because of its
apparent prevalence in business environments (Well RHES anyway), and that
you're likely to encounter it in the workplace at some point. I don't
really get what makes it special beyond that, but lots of people swear by
it. Years ago, it was my first abortive attempt at using Linux. Red Hat
has done a lot for Linux PR.

People seem to really like Suse a lot but it has a vaguely business feel
to it like Red Hat does. This may be a plus or minus depending how you
look at it. I've never used it but I will say that you don't hear a lot
of negatives about it. Consistently, people *seem* to like it a lot.
Like Mandrake, it has a really easy installer.

Ubuntu. This is the flavor of the week right now. Every so often a new
distribution comes out with a lot of velocity and enthusiasm and people
jump on the bandwagon. Whether Ubuntu's popularity will last, I don't
know (I think it will though; people seem to be getting really positive
vibes from the support community there and I think the support community
is really what, in the long run, is going to make the difference). Ubuntu
has a really good, positive philosophy and is built on a good platform
(Debian Linux). I haven't used it, but I do use Debian. If I was
starting out fresh right now I'd probably start with Ubuntu.

Crustier distributions:

Slackware, Debian

Slackware is the Fugazi of linux distros, with a lot of loyalty, and it's
also a really old distribution. Though completely devoid of flash, it has
a fiercely loyal user community. Fortunately or unfortunately, it also
relies a lot on the work of one guy. In this it seems to avoid "too many
witches spoiling the brew", but there's also the possibility of stagnation
if the project's leader goes out of commission, which he did briefly due
to illness. Though I am sure many old-timers started with Slackware, I am
guessing that most people wouldn't consider this an ideal beginner's
distro. Down the road though, don't be surprised if you find yourself
using this. Also don't be surprised if you find people recommending it to
you. I can't think of a single thing (until Gnome, of late) that someone
hasn't recommended Slackware for.

Debian is (if I had to guess) the distribution that would most likely
survive a nuclear holocaust. Zombies would be wandering the earth, but
probably Debian would still be around. I like Debian, and the new
installer addresses some of the supposed complications of installing it (I
have never had any issue with getting Debian installed; I'm not sure why
it has that reputation). For a long time Debian had the best package
management around (which is a major concern especially when you're a
beginner), but this gap has closed somewhat. I still like Debian a lot
and use it on two of my four Linux systems here at home, and I'm actually
relatively new to it. It's hard not to be enthusiastic about it. It's an
incredibly easy distribution to use.

Lastly, and somewhat heretically, there is last week's "flavor of the
week", Gentoo Linux. Gentoo Linux has a long install process (though
meticulously documented; it takes time but I don't find it complicated).
In a way it's a bit like boot camp. You'll be partitioning your drives
manually, setting up file systems, configuring your kernel, and in fact
compiling all the software on your machine using Gentoo's tools. Gentoo
more than most is a love it or hate it distribution. What I like about
it, and why I really kind of disagree with the majority of folks and think
it's a great beginner's distribution, is that it really does introduce you
up front to a lot of how Linux works. Though it contains many whizzo
tools (like portage, its package manager) to expedite things, it sort of
exposes on a high level what's "under the hood" in Linux up front. Kind
of the way when you buy a new car the salesman points out all of the
features of the car when you go to pick it up.

The first Linux I ever tried and stuck with for awhile was Mandrake.
Usable almost immediately, one thing that I found complicated (this might
be a personal issue only) was learning how things worked. Too many GUI
tools and the like spoiled me outright, but when something went wrong, I
wasn't sure where to start troubleshooting.

I installed Gentoo just to try to do it since everyone was making a big
stink over how complicated it was (It isn't; it's just very manual. And
the Gentoo handbook which has instructions for the installation is
extremely easy to follow and well written. It's really not much of an
accomplishment to get it set up.) Well, after 3 months of using Linux
(Mandrake) I was able to get it installed just fine following the
instructions. Along the way I got used to editing configuration files by
hand, recompiling kernels, thinking about partitioning, and so on. The
Gentoo community is also superb and maybe even a model for how support
communities should work.

Gentoo is still pretty high-level. You'll do
some major tasks manually but much of it is done with Gentoo's fairly
rocking tools (well, mostly rocking anyway). It also takes forever
because, depending on the install option you choose, you'll be compiling
(non-interactively; you can have the machine do most of this while you
sleep) for a long time. There are quicker ways of doing a Gentoo install
but if you seriously consider installing it as a beginner, choose the
Stage 1 (lowest level) install. It's worth it to do once, just to do it.

If I could go back and talk to my pre-Linux self, I would tell myself to
just start with Gentoo straight-out. Gentoo will not make you a computer
whiz but it will make you fearless about poking around (and you'll have at
least a vague inkling where to poke around) from the outset, and this is a
necessary skill, I think. My other two computers - the one I'm typing on
now, and the IBM Thinkpad in the living room, run Gentoo. At this point I
could run Debian or Gentoo and be happy but there's something just really
satisfying and easily-tweakable about Gentoo.

Of course anything you can do in one distro, you can do in another. It's
a question of how easy it is to tweak (USE flags in Gentoo are what I'm
mainly thinking about here), and how to even know these options are there.
 You will hear subjective reports about Gentoo being faster than other
 disributions, and though possibly true (this is a controversial subject),
 this doesn't seem like one of the better reasons to run it as a beginner.
  You will hear it takes a long time to install software. This is true in
 a sense but it is non-interactve, and once you have your basic system
 installed, you can just background it.

So I guess my recommendation is Gentoo if you are really serious about
jumping in full bore and wanting an immediate "basics" course in Linux.
Otherwise, probably Ubuntu just based on the positive buzz and things I've
heard.

In the end, people generally will recommend what they know best. Momentum
drives choice. Linux is Linux.

It is hard to understand if you're coming from Windows but at its root
Linux distributions all have a common way of doing things at the lowest
level. What differs is the tools they build on top of these raw
methodologies. In the long run, it's good to understand the raw
methodologies (like how to download source code and compile it and install
it), and then you can decide what "overlays" or "tools" you prefer to use
instead. Where things are simple and easy, there is generally a tradeoff
in terms of easy tweakability. Where things are complex, things can be
time consuming but more easily customizeable. Until you know your way,
basically, around Linux, you're probably not going to know which "angle"
you want to go in. Contrary to what some people suggest, there is
probably a place, a purpose, and an audience, for every distribution.

In choosing one distribution over another, you're not actually choosing
some functionalities and losing others (well, for the most part; there
are a few differences). You're just choosing different ways of doing the
same things.

I think Gentoo is a great place to start because it's going to force you
to decide up front if you love it or hate it. And depending on how you
feel about Gentoo, you're going to be able to make an educated decision
going forward about what distribution to use over the long haul (though
some people tend to switch distributions fairly regularly; I'm not one of
them).

Just whatever you do, don't choose a distribution based on its "coolness"
factor. Many people who chose Gentoo for this reason (or choose it today)
don't stick around long because there are definitely tradeoffs with Gentoo
like there is with any other distro (Gentoo is a distribution of
extremes). Ubuntu is the "cool" distro right now but the warm and
fuzzies, unlike Gentoo, are not really based around the geek factor.

As a new user, expect to change distributions in a few months, with
whatever you choose. You might get lucky and choose the perfect long-haul
distribution for you but right now pick one, and learn it, and take notes
about what you like and don't like about it, and in a few months look
around for a distribution that more closely matches your tastes once
you're educated enough to know what you want. ("I don't want to have to
take all of this time to compile", "I don't want to have to build my own
kernel.", "I want better hardware detection because I have weird stuff in
my system", "I want a better way of maintaining configuration files", "I
want a different package management system")

Though you could conceivably be a casual Linux user, using it just to
check mail and browse the web, Linux is quite powerful, and I think you
really get the most out of it if you are willing to dig deep into its guts
and learn things like shell scripting, especially. It is amazing the
amount of tedious tasks that can be automated.

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