Re: machine

From: +Cibao+ (Cibao_at_softhome.net)
Date: 10/08/03 

Date: 7 Oct 2003 20:32:15 -0500

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Ohmster tempted the fates in alt.os.linux
by rushing in here and proclaiming the following to be true:

> Question: How do you update major and minor "packages" then without rpm
> managment like with slackware?

You've got a couple of choices:

1.) You can use Slackware's package management system, aka 'pkgtools'
The pkgtools are what a user would use to:

installpkg - Install a Slackware package
upgradepkg - "Upgrade" a Slackware package.
removepkg - Remove a Slackware package.

or

2.) You can compile the program from the source.
If you compile from the source, you can either:

A.) Keep the original source directory around if the author(s) included
the 'make uninstall' option to their Makefile(s)

or

B.) Use a spiffy program, like "checkinstall"

Checkinstall
<URL:http://asic-linux.com.mx/~izto/checkinstall/index.php>

to monitor your installation process(es) to create an installable (and
subsequently UN-installable) package for your $OS.

> I use Redhat 9

I'm sorry to hear that.
You have my sincerest sympathies. ;)

> and use up2date or apt-synaptic to get my system updated.

<sarcasm>
All that rpm-dependency hunting sure is fun, ain't it? =)
</sarcasm>

> I tried to update mozilla without using a manager
> and downloaded all the mozilla rpm files and tried "rpm -Uvh mozilla*" and it
> still would not work that way, more dependancy issues.

That's what we Slackersc refer to as "RPM Hell".
It's also what drives alot of RPM-distro users to other distros in the end.
(myself being no exception - I used RH & MDK, both, before switching to SW.)

> When I tried to update kde with apt and synaptic, eveytime I wanted to
> install something, something else had to get uninstalled,

Yup. RPM hell. =)

> so I forced it.

Which, of course, completely defeats the entire point of using an RPM-based
distro in the first place. =)

If you're eventually 'forced' to "rpm -i -force -nodeps" damn near every
program, what's even the point in using something as fragile and
ass-backwards as RPM? (unless you're into self-abuse, I suppose.)

> Broke the hell out of gnome after that, no sound and could not log into
> any gnome session anymore, as any user.

That sounds just like some of the RPM horror stories I've heard, and alot
like my own experiences - which is why I stopped using RPM distros.

> Updated to RH9 to fix it.

Now _THERE_ was a "Win-Solution" if I ever heard one.
You "updated" to an entirely new version of your OS, just to resolve your
dependency errors?

Ick.

> So how do you update major stuff on slackware if you do everything by
> compiling from source?

You don't /have/ to compile everthing from source-
There's (apparently) lotsa folks who prefer to _not_ learn compilation and
thus just use pre-compiled packages that others make available at sites
like <URL:http://linuxpackages.net/>.

Personally speaking, I got into using Slackware for all the control it
offers me, and I'm _really_ not keen on using packages made from sources
that I don't trust. Even then, I still tend to re-compile just
about everything to my own tastes and preferences, which is why I refer to
my particular installation as "Slackenstein" instead of just SW.

Granted, I'm an extremist, but you get the general idea. =)

> Don't the libs and different softwares fight with each
> other and break each other?

Nope.

When you ./configure your source code, the script will tell you what deps
you have (and need) for any given application or program.

For example, just this last week I grabbed the source for gnome 2.4.1,
compiled it all to my likings (even though I don't use the Gnome DE).

Just out of my own curiosity.
Additionally, I grabbed the source for Ximian's 'Evolution' and compiled
that in response to a thread over in AOSLS, just to see how (if at all)
difficult the process was. It really wasn't any more complicated than the
"standard" commands of:

./configure --$PREFIX --$OPTIONS
make
make install

I used 'checkinstall' to create packages for everything, so that I can then
use the Slackware pkgtools to upgrade, install and remove them at will.

It all sounds much more complicated than it really is.

Between the ./configure error messages, and the README and/or INSTALL
files, you've really got just about everything you need. It's actually a
pretty rare event to run into a just-plain-impossible-to-compile program.

Even if you /do/ run into issues, it's almost a given that someone ELSE has
had the same problem and found their answer already.

That's where using Google comes into play.
It's your friend. =)

- --
Cibao Cu' Ali G. Colibri | The great masses of the people ... will
GnuPG Pub Key EC9F1D51 -o) | more easily fall victims to a big lie than
Linux Kernel 2.6.0-t6 /\\ | to a small one. -- Adolf Hitler, "Mein
Slackenstein 9.0-ish _\_v | Kampf", 1933
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