Re: HELP!About download FC4 images.

On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 15:58:52 +0100, Michael Heiming staggered into the
Black Sun and said:
> In comp.os.linux.misc Dances With Crows wrote:
>> On Fri, 30 Dec 2005 08:24:35 -0500, Jean-David Beyer staggered into the
>> Black Sun and said:
>>> You are right there! Can you imagine an OS you must pay for where
>>> you do not even get a compiler? What good is a computer when you
>>> cannot even write programs for it?
>> What, did they remove GWBASIC from 'DozeXP? :-)
> Isn't it an interpreter "language"? ;-)

Yeah, well, so is Perl, and hardly anybody complains about the Perl
interpreter :-)

>> Today's typical user doesn't know *how* to program. Sad but true.
> Even moving a mouse isn't that easy today.

? When I first saw a 128K Macintosh (1985 or so; I was 9) it had a
"demo attract" program running. That program was a basic "how to move a
mouse, how to click, how to drag, how to double-click..." thing. I
picked it up in < 10 minutes. Mice these days have extra buttons and
scrool wheels, but that shouldn't add much complexity to a program like
that. I think the problem is not that these "totally new user" programs
don't exist, it's that everyone assumes mousing is a basic skill and
everybody knows it already.

>> I started using computers (Apple //c, w00t!) a lot of simple
>> utilities were written in BASIC. That sucked as a language, but it
> Iirc those had or came with pascal, which was the preferred
> programming language those days in schools

Nope. The Apple II series all had a version of BASIC in their ROMs.
Pascal was a fairly expensive ($200?) addon, so it didn't get used that
much. Of course, on a system that tiny, the only way to get anything
done quickly was to use assembly, which was just a tiny bit difficult.

> to have a few of those darn expensive systems. The major problem was
> they didn't have much if any teacher who were able to teach kids about
> them, let alone being comfortable with the equipment.

IMHO, Pascal was always the wrong language for trying to teach people
about programming. Too much bondage and discipline. There was a
version of Logo for the Apple II (procedures, recursion, list
processing, and turtle graphics too) and that worked fairly well for
kids.

>> like cars--very few people are interested in fuel injection profiles
>> or how to replace spark plugs; they just want to get groceries and
>> drive the kids to school.
> Ack, they don't know anymore even the most basic things about cars and
> just wonder if something goes wrong.

Most people know a *few* things about cars. "Put gas in it or it won't
run, get oil changed every X,000 miles, don't leave it unlocked, call
dealership/AAA if big problem" actually suffices for most people. The
thing is, computers change a lot faster than cars do. The knowledge I
acquired in 1984 about the //c is almost totally useless[0] wrt my
2004-vintage desktop x86. The knowledge my dad acquired in 1966, when
he learned to drive the family pickup truck, has allowed him to drive
almost every car/truck he's encountered since.

[0] "Read The Fine Manual before doing something new" is probably the
only exception.

--
Matt G|There is no Darkness in Eternity/But only Light too dim for us to see
Brainbench MVP for Linux Admin / mail: TRAP + SPAN don't belong
http://www.brainbench.com / "He is a rhythmic movement of the
-----------------------------/ penguins, is Tux." --MegaHAL
.